Speaker 1 (0s): This is Bruce Friedman of Adult Site Broker, and welcome to Adult Site Broker Talk, where each week we interview one of the movers and shakers of the adult industry, and we give you a tip on buying and selling websites. This week we'll be speaking with Chris Jeffrey of Saucy Time. Adult Site Broker is proud to announce the launch of our new website, adult Site Broker three point 0 at adultsitebroker.com.
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We're offering very limited information at the seller's request. In order to maintain privacy, we anticipate multiple offers for this very rare listing. For more information, contact email@example.com. Now time for this week's interview. My guest today on Adult Site Broker talk is Chris Jeffrey of Saucy Time. Chris, thanks for being with us today on Adult Site Broker Talk.
Speaker 2 (2m 15s): It's a pleasure, Bruce. Thanks for the invitation.
Speaker 1 (2m 18s): It's nice to have you. Now Chris is a 46 year old entrepreneur, father of seven year old daughter Ella. He lives with his wife and business partner in Southeast Asia. Chris launched and operates the only 100% mobile adult web app saucy time with his wife and business partner. Following successful careers in the city. They realized life was too short and embarked upon a new chapter in their lives, deciding that London was not the best place to raise a child. So they moved out to Southeast Asia.
In addition to a decade running a hedge fund, Chris has been involved in other projects, including the development of Android TV set top boxes, the development of 180 degree virtual reality streaming webcam platform among, among other ventures. Chris is also executive director of the VR guys, a virtual reality software development company. Sasi Time is the first and only webcam platform, specifically designed for mobile use launched in 2012.
It has over 180,000 members and features around a hundred models, originally only available for Apple devices. Their platform now also supports Android sasi. Time is one of the most competitive platforms on the market. Recruitment is via invitation and referral only. So Chris, why don't you tell us a bit about your background in the adult industry.
Speaker 2 (3m 42s): It was pretty limited. You, you, you, during your introduction, you mentioned that I ran a hedge fund. Yeah, I, I actually recruited for hedge funds. Just to, just to be clear. Oh, so my, my role, yeah. My role was, was, was this a recruitment consultant, finding guys to work for hedge funds. I think if I had my own hedge fund, we probably wouldn't be having this conversation. This is true. My experience was, was pretty much limited to lurking the streets of soho three in London, right.
At sort of 3:00 AM you know, perusing the, the shelves of the adult video stores that existed back then. Dunno if you've ever been to London or at that time. Yeah. But you remember the video stores legally, they weren't allowed to call themselves adult video stores. It was a video store, and then you had this sort of Aladdin's cave at the back with, you know, colorful sort of, you know, paper drapes.
And, you know, you'd sneak in through there and, and that's where you'd find all of the latest vhs, all of the latest VHS videos. So, yeah, you know, and funnily enough, I remember going into these stores and on unsuccessful nights back in the, back in the nineties and sliding sort of 20 quid over after a little bit of time, making a decision about what my viewing pleasure was gonna be for, for that evening.
In solitude. In solitude. And wondering, you know, had this guy end up getting this job, you know, he's peddling, you know, peddling, peddling porn. And, you know, we are 30 years later, I'm the sort of modern version of that guy. So I worked in the city as I, as I mentioned, you know, I, I had no, no real interest to be perfectly honest. Beyond that, you know, like anybody else, I, I didn't have an unhealthy interest in, in, in pornography.
That wasn't, that wasn't what drove me into the industry. It was completely, it was completely by acc. Hmm. In completely by accident. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (6m 20s): So how did saucy time get started?
Speaker 2 (6m 22s): I saw an opportunity, I suppose, I think, you know, the webcam industry had already been in existence for a decade or so, streaming, you know, streaming video websites and, and so on. And it seemed like a fairly sort of closed shop. And I'm sure a lot of these companies hugely successful, much more successful, I'm sure you know, than, than than we are. You know,
Speaker 1 (6m 52s): There are big ones. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (6m 53s): Yeah. Millions of millions of members sort of occurred to me that the direction the entertainment itself was heading was into mobile, the iPhone. I remember seeing the iPhone for the first time and hearing about this thing called FaceTime. Didn't, wasn't sure if it would take off or not until my wife, now wife showed me a call that she was having with her brother. You know, as the pickup started, you know, people started to, to buy iPhones and I was just blown away by this like, mobile to mobile connection.
Yeah. You didn't need your phone number, you could do it via an email address. You know, the quality was amazing. Yeah. And yeah, it did. It sort of, it stuck in my head and like any business ideas or at least yeah. Those that are made on the back of a beer map, you know, I was having a pin with a, a friend of mine, as I mentioned, I ran a technology recruitment consultancy for hedge funds. So, you know, I had access to the best and brightest technologists, you know, and a lot of these guys that I'd found jobs for I became friends with, you know, and I'd regularly meet them out for, for drinks.
But my friend told me the iPad two was coming out and that it was due to our FaceTime. And I thought, apple is serious about this. Right? It's not a feature that's gonna go away, that they're, you know, they're putting their weight behind it. So is there a way that we could take this concept of mobile to mobile and apply it in webcam setting, you know, is that gonna be possible?
So I got on the phone to another friend of mine who is, you know, he's a ex Microsoft genius who was in his twenties at the time, and he was a director. And I said to him, look, I've had this idea, I've already run it past this one friend of mine. But as you know, obviously different people have different roles and different skill sets and technology. So Will was the guy who I thought, okay, he's gonna be able to answer these questions.
So I said, look, if I take you and a few of your guys out for, for beers, could you give me an hour of your time? You know, could we, I, I've had an idea for a business and I just wanna run it past you.
Speaker 1 (9m 32s): It's amazing what beers will buy.
Speaker 2 (9m 35s): It's incredible, isn't it? It's incredible. We all got together in, this is funny, you know, I went over to their head office, this blue chip won't mentioned the company name, but was a, a blue chip company household name, and this guy is the technical director or director of the particular group. And he pulls a few couple of guys into the boardroom and he's got, you know, the whiteboard up there and process flow diagrams.
And he's like, you know, go and grab, you know, the database guys, the database guy comes in and all of a sudden for the price of a few beers, you know, I've got this sort of group of very highly skilled and experienced tech guys explaining how they can make my idea work. You know, how, how, how it could, how it could be put together. That was it, you know, it was, it was seeing FaceTime for the first time.
It was realizing that Apple had a fantastic video streaming platform that was only gonna get better. The only that, you know, you know, that was only get better, right? They're gonna continue investing in it. So it is always gonna be the best on the market. And if it was possible to piggyback onto that, this was a potentially feasible business opportunity.
Speaker 1 (11m 11s): Sure. So with no background in the industry, no name or established brand, how did you go about recruiting models
Speaker 2 (11m 19s): At that time? Twitter was, was a different place. And there, there were two things really. There was Twitter and there was bribery because first of all, the iPad too had only just come out and had a, a friend of mine who happened to work for Apple, not on the retail side, but he worked for Apple, and the iPad too is just about to be released. And this was at the time when you'd get cues of people outside the store, you know?
Sure. Really excited about.
Speaker 1 (11m 55s): They still do,
Speaker 2 (11m 57s): Do they, do they still do that? Yeah. Wow. Okay. Yeah, I'm surprised because the innovation seems to have slowed a little bit. You know, I, I don't
Speaker 1 (12m 10s): Still got your Apple fan fanboy. I, I'm, I hate to say it, but I'm kind of one too. So
Speaker 2 (12m 15s): You're not in a tent the night before though, are you?
Speaker 1 (12m 19s): Oh, hell no. I'm not nuts, but I have, but I have been in a line before, let's put it that way.
Speaker 2 (12m 27s): Okay. Okay. You're running out of the store, you know, brandishing you and new your new purchase.
Speaker 1 (12m 33s): No, I just rem I just remember when the iPhone 12 came out, I, I had to stand in line to pay them. That's the only line I've stood in, which kind of bugged me. But anyway, go ahead.
Speaker 2 (12m 44s): I spoke to my friend at Apple. I said, look, I need to get hold of these ipo, you know, iPad twos, how am I going to, can you get me one on the day? You know, well, I need a bit more than one. He's like, well, how many do you need? I said, well, kind of 10. And he said, you know that they're gonna sell out just on the day. He said, but if you're a business customer of Apples, you just register as a business with Apple, then you can pre-order,
Speaker 1 (13m 15s): Right?
Speaker 2 (13m 16s): Yeah. You can pre-order your, your devices unlimited number registered with Apple as a business place. The order, I should mention, at this point, the, the funding for the project sort of was partly due to my wife's belief in the product, in, in the idea, because obviously, you know, 10 iPads are not cheap.
Sure. But yeah, she put those on her credit card. So we've got 10 iPads. So then it was a case of, okay, let's go on to Twitter and let's start talking to these girls and see if they'd be interested in joining our startup. Not guaranteeing them huge amounts of business, but they get a free iPad, you know, if they stay with us for a certain amount of time, you know, cool.
I mean, not, you know, you get one and run. We, we made sort of connections and made real life connections as well, because obviously being in London, we'd meet up with my wife, tell the girls about the idea, get a few of the girls together, and it became like this nice sort of community of, you know, 10 girls, some of them, some of which are still with us, actually. Yeah. Hopefully not working with the same iPad, but just because we had an adult business, I wanted to treat it like any other business and recruitment Sure.
Was, was part of that, you
Speaker 1 (14m 57s): Know. Well, you certainly knew recruitment, right?
Speaker 2 (14m 59s): I didn't see why it should be any different. No. And all of the other web, all of the other webcam sites seemed to be registered here to become a model. Now, just because you own a webcam doesn't necessarily mean that you are a webcam model, right. I mean, I suppose in principle, sorry, in in, yeah, in theory it does, but not really. I mean, you know, we were, we were looking for published models when, you know, publishing was a thing and we had a, a bit of a partnership with Loaded, and that gave us a name to piggyback off, you know, very good.
We had a partnership with this men's magazine, and we did a deal with them where we do a shoot, we provide the girls. That's how we managed to get the talent. But we're running a 24 hour operation. Sure. Now the notifications for the bookings are delivered via sms. So these, I mean, these girls were fantastic. So they'd sleep with their phones in their brass, so to cover the, to cover the US market with their phone number vibrate if they got a booking, because, you know, bookings were few and far between in the beginning.
Right. Then they'd get an alert, quickly, send a text message, Joe, just give me a second, honey, as they wake up at four in the morning. And they'd do, and they'd do, and they do recall, and it was thanks to them and their hard work, the business actually managed to, to take off because there were girls online, you know? Yeah. And sure. Cause I think we'd given, there was good faith there because obviously we'd trusted them with a 500 pound device, you know?
Speaker 1 (16m 51s): Yeah. Definitely.
Speaker 2 (16m 53s): It was reciprocated. And as I say, some of those, some of those girls are still with us
Speaker 1 (16m 58s): Now. Great. So in your experience, how have customer preferences changed during the last decade and how have you adjusted?
Speaker 2 (17m 8s): If we go back further than a, you know, even further than a decade, I can only talk from my personal experience. We're, we're in, we're we're there or thereabouts, in terms of generation, you'll, you'll get what I'm talking about. But we had a Sure, a newspaper in the UK called The Sun, and we also had one called Daily Start, like a tab, you know, like a red top tabloid
Speaker 1 (17m 35s): Newspaper. Big time. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (17m 37s): And at the time before everybody got so bloody serious, used to have page three girls, my friend's dad was a reader of, was a reader of the daily start. So I'd nip over to my friend's house just to leave through the back editions of page seven. And, you know, that was, that was our kind of pornography of, of the time.
Then obviously as you get a bit older, it escalated to magazines. Yeah. Right. And then to vhs. And there was a nice sort of, you know, storyline. You know, the postman turns up and, you know, the, the housewife bends over and yeah. It's just very, very corny now when you look, when you look back. But at the time, you know, it was, you'd sit there and watch it, you
Speaker 1 (18m 40s): Know, hasn't changed that much.
Speaker 2 (18m 42s): It's gonna happen next, but hasn't it, because I mean, I, I'm not porn,
Speaker 1 (18m 46s): Porn hasn't, I mean, I, there's still, there's still a lot of the pizza guy and the, and the pool guy. And I always, I always joke when our pool guy gets here, I said, here's the, the most famous porn actor in the world.
Speaker 2 (18m 59s): I was under the misapprehension that porn had changed from those sort of storylines very much in the same way as, you know, TikTok and YouTube shorts to just being, you know, somewhat
Speaker 1 (19m 15s): Banned. Yeah. Somewhat, but somewhat, but not completely.
Speaker 2 (19m 19s): Okay. Okay. So in terms of how consumer tastes have developed, I think, you know, people have seems to have done a little bit of a 180 because, you know, people wanted more and more and more and more, but then decided, maybe got to a point where they realized that, you know, gynecology wasn't for them. And, and actually they preferred something a little, a little more that had a little of, you know, the illusion of romance or some sexual attraction.
You could be the postman type, you know, or the poor guy, Bruce's, Bruce's poor guy. You know, one can only dream, right. But in order to compete, the porn industry seemed to be releasing more and more and more graphic and misogynistic sort of, you know, pour true. And I think tastes have now shifted away from that a little bit because
Speaker 1 (20m 25s): The Me Too era. Sure.
Speaker 2 (20m 27s): Yeah. That, that also, I think that guys now want to feel that there is a connection between them and the performer. And whilst I felt there was a connection between myself and, you know, a black and white photo of Samantha Fox, famous page three girl. Yeah. 30 or 40 years ago, my wasn't, I wasn't seven.
Speaker 1 (20m 55s): You sure?
Speaker 2 (20m 56s): Maybe they felt a connection between them and, and the performer. I guess that's, you know, your, your POV type thing and why that's we want our customers to feel a connection with the performer. Yeah. You know, a lot of webcam that some of them may make is that they think that, you know, the guys are only interested in seeing their bits, you know, that, that, that's it.
Speaker 1 (21m 26s): Another British term I'm gonna steal They're bits
Speaker 2 (21m 31s): And they're naughty bits. Yeah. They're naughty bits. Got it. So, yeah. So to in order, you know, to, to get that sort of dopamine dump, you know, like that first kiss, if you meet somebody for the first time, you're gonna first date, you know, the exciting bit is not necessarily the, the sex, right. It's the anticipation. It's the lead up to the sex, it's the, you know, you know, sharing.
Speaker 1 (22m 1s): I think I, I think I remember, yeah,
Speaker 2 (22m 5s): It's been a while for me as well, you know? Yep. I've been married a long time, but Sam, I
Speaker 1 (22m 10s): Saw you sent me a, sent me a picture of you and your lovely wife, and Yes, I can understand.
Speaker 2 (22m 15s): Yeah. Not, not for any untoward reasons, though. That's not my
Speaker 1 (22m 20s): Scene. No. She was clothed.
Speaker 2 (22m 22s): The excitement is the lead up, you know, is she, isn't she? But you know, the kiss, you know? Yeah.
Speaker 1 (22m 30s): It's like, like a, like a virtual, like a virtual girlfriend.
Speaker 2 (22m 33s): Right. That is exactly what we wanted to create, emulate, you know? Right. Is not okay, you know, I need to see a vagina. It's, I've got a shitty day, you know, my friends are all out with their girlfriends or whatever. Right. You know, I wanna get home from work, I wanna pour myself a glass of wine and I'm gonna see who's available on s time, or I
Speaker 1 (23m 2s): Know, or I'm gonna, or I'm going to talk to Stacy because that's, that's the one that I like. Right?
Speaker 2 (23m 9s): Exactly. Exactly. Yeah. If I know that she Stacy's available, I'm gonna talk to Stacy. Yeah. We're gonna have a chat and it, and it may not even result in, and this is again, one of the things that I, that surprised me, I think, was that a lot of the time it is just that it is
Speaker 1 (23m 28s): Just, yeah. It's just a conversation. It's not necessarily leading to the guy, to the guy jerking off. I, I get it. No. Yeah. So from what I understand, you operate a flat rate for all models. Now, does this not include performers that operate at a higher rate?
Speaker 2 (23m 47s): The value that a performer puts upon themselves is really sort of based upon what people are prepared to pay. Sure. Now, a lot of these models have been on tv, they've been in magazines, and they have hardcore fans, and those hardcore fans are prepared to pay 10, 15, $20. You know, the whole sort of, you know, cash cow type movement.
That's why it exists. It's because, you know, these guys get, yeah, these guys get sort of semi obsessed with, with these models. But I'm sorry, that doesn't mean that that's what Joe Blogs who's never heard of you, is going to be prepared to pay. This
Speaker 1 (24m 41s): Is
Speaker 2 (24m 41s): True. To listen to you speak, you know, you are not, you are not Warren Buffett, you know, it's like,
Speaker 1 (24m 49s): And I quite, quite frankly, I wouldn't wanna see him naked, to be honest with you.
Speaker 2 (24m 53s): I don't, if he was paying me, I'd do it,
Speaker 1 (24m 56s): It would have to be a lot.
Speaker 2 (24m 60s): Now, I'd undercut your rate, I'd undercut your rate, no problem at all. Watching Warren Buffett get naked. But no, I mean, there is, you know, this is somebody whose time is really valuable and you know, he has his very same as motivational speakers, although I'm not a big fan of that industry, but, you know, celebrities. Celebrities, let's say for instance, right? So that's a great example. So celebrities just one big brother.
Yeah. Market val, you know, market rate per hour is x, you know, thousand pounds, you know, big rider, thousand pounds an hour, you know, big rider, big name, blah, blah, blah. Same as the influencers, you know, they all have their value, but when it comes to camming, if there aren't really any sort of household camgirl names, really, you know, it's, it's a very, very large,
Speaker 1 (26m 2s): So you've got your, you've got your more successful ones, but you're probably right.
Speaker 2 (26m 6s): Yeah, of course. But it's not like, you know, your Jenna Jameson, you know, of the webcam industry. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (26m 13s): Agreed.
Speaker 2 (26m 14s): So what, what I tell, you know, what I tell these girls is look, when we explain our rate structure to them, I mean, they get paid the man. Do you think that we're providing a charitable service here? We spending, you know, thousands of pounds on advertising and marketing and driving new business to our site so we can pay you a hundred percent of the call value? Of course not. Right? You know, it's a, a business and we have costs that we need to meet.
How many of these five pound per minute bookings do you get in an hour? Oh, well, you know, I'll get maybe, yeah, yeah. Maybe one an hour. How long? Five minutes. Something like that. Sure. Okay. So in the hour you are basically being paid $25, is that right? Yeah. Right. Okay. How about you worked the full hour and you got paid 60 pounds, 70 pounds, you know, whatever.
But that's how we tackle that is
Speaker 1 (27m 22s): Interesting.
Speaker 2 (27m 23s): Is the, you know, it's the elasticity, I suppose.
Speaker 1 (27m 26s): So people, so people book the models by the hour?
Speaker 2 (27m 29s): Not, not, some do, some do, but mostly by the minute. The pattern normally is when we bring a new model into the site, she'll, the people that haven't been with us for a while will book the minimum amount of time possible, which is 10 pounds. So for that 10 pounds, they'll get a five minute, a five minute call. And then they'll, because they wanna make sure that this isn't a photo that was taken 1986.
Speaker 1 (28m 4s): That.
Speaker 2 (28m 5s): Yeah. Like that ever happens. There's like dating profiles. Right,
Speaker 1 (28m 10s): Exactly.
Speaker 2 (28m 11s): So they wanna make sure that this, this is the same person, this is the right person. And also that they're gonna get along. Most of our girls are English, well, they're all English speaking native English speakers or, or fluent English speakers. But, you know, there are other sites that employ girls from different areas and perhaps, you know, the humor isn't the same. They don't have the same common interest. Don't watch the same course soap operas, you know, don't listen to the same music, that sort of thing.
So five minutes is enough, you know, for for them, got for them, you know, you understand, understand. Yeah. Von Yeah. Okay. Thank, thank you for your time with our girls. They will book longer calls, but they also sort of sometimes overestimate their staying power as it means. Sure. They'll, they'll book a 20 minute call and Yeah, maybe it won't last the full 20 minutes because somebody's had an, somebody's had ano had a whoopi.
There's another English term, another English term for you. Somebody's had that a, a little, little slip.
Speaker 1 (29m 29s): You don't offer tipping. Is there a reason for that?
Speaker 2 (29m 32s): Yes, because, and, and again, it goes back to the human connection. You know, it's like being in on Harvey Nick's fifth floor and realizing that the girl that you've been talking to for the last hour, that's shown, that's laughed at all your jokes and is stunning, likes nice things, and maybe wants a present, you know? And then you realize it, it all becomes about money and then it spoil and then it spoils it all.
Speaker 1 (30m 8s): Yes, it's a good point. But that is what it's all about to the models.
Speaker 2 (30m 12s): Well, it is, and it isn't because they want to enjoy their job.
Speaker 1 (30m 16s): Yeah, I agree.
Speaker 2 (30m 17s): You know, and it's like, they're not, they're not performing animals at a circus, you know? True. These are like anybody, you know, you've got a shitty boss or you've got shitty coworkers or shitty customers, you're not gonna enjoy what you do. Sure. But if you are in an environment where the customers are, are nice to you, they're interested in you in reverse, you know, that mutual sort of respect and interested, if that's reciprocated, and again, you know, it comes back to the personality of the performer, you know, they need to be engaging and it's not about, you know, you gotta be engaging because we've gotta bleed this customer dry.
Doesn't matter, it's a five minute call. As long as it's the best five minutes of that guy's day, we've done our job, you know? Oh, sure. And if she's good at her job, then he's going to divert some of his disposable income away from, you know, video games or, you know, going to the pub into spending a little bit of time with her.
Sure. He understands that she's being paid for it. But unlike, unlike Skype, which is very much, you know, talking to granny and granddad in Australia, that's not very sexy for me. What, you know, for me, you know, being at the family PC and trying to position the wobbly webcam and you know, dropping your trousers and it's like the old joke, what's the most sensitive part of your body when you are masturbating your ears, being at the, the sort of family PC where you pay your bills and then, you know, streaming into a live chat and all this sort of, it's not, that's not a very personal thing, but when was that time you used FaceTime for business?
When was this last time you used FaceTime for anything other than talking to people that you want to talk to? It's your phone. Sure. It's locked away. There's no web history, you know, there's nothing to disguise. People don't share their phones. Yeah. And the, the girls are encouraged and, and will send a text message on a Thursday afternoon and say, you know, hey, you know, hey Billy, did you get the promotion you were talking about?
You told me about last week. Something like that. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Part of that is a sales call, but part of that is a sales pitch, I suppose. But part of it is also, you know, you remembered that this guy had a promotion, you probably wanted him to get it, you know? Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (33m 20s): Exactly.
Speaker 2 (33m 21s): And that's the, that's the disconnect.
Speaker 1 (33m 23s): It makes 'em, it makes 'em at least feel that they care.
Speaker 2 (33m 25s): But yeah, I mean, you you say feel that they care, but I do think that they, they in, in some cases, and it varies from girl to girl, and it's probably the reason why course we only have a hundred girls in a thousand girls is because the girls that we have, we've chosen very, very carefully. Yes. We've taken time to make sure that, you know, they're not, you know, these man hating, you know, you are my cash pig, want do an, I wanna do an ATM meat, you know?
Yeah. Sort of daddy issues type, you know, type background are not just in it for the money because Right. That's not, you know, that's not what it's about. Give the guy a few extra minutes, you know? Sure. When the, when the five minutes is up, don't end the call. Don't hang up on him. Right. You know, tell him he's running out of time. Maybe he'll stick another few minutes or maybe he needs another couple of minutes. Give him another couple of minutes, you know, there's no skin off your nose, he'll come back to you.
It will pay off.
Speaker 1 (34m 33s): You know, it's nice to see, it's nice to see a company have that attitude. Because I, I know that your competitors don't, what do you think makes for a successful cam model?
Speaker 2 (34m 46s): Well, I think that depends upon the platform for the big sites. Obviously it's gonna be, you know, big social media presence, you know, endorsement, marketing, expose, you know, that, that, that's I suppose on that level, how you would determine success. You know, being very, very sort of, very visible, very profitable. What makes a good one?
It's really simple. I'm sure you're familiar with the term, although again, it's another English term banter.
Speaker 1 (35m 27s): Love it. What is it?
Speaker 2 (35m 28s): Banter.
Speaker 1 (35m 29s): Oh yeah, no, that's, that's actually used in the US too. That's good.
Speaker 2 (35m 32s): Yeah. Yeah. You, you got there a bit late then. We've been, we've been saying, we've been been saying it longer than you. We invented it.
Speaker 1 (35m 39s): You've been saying everything longer than us.
Speaker 2 (35m 41s): That's true. That's true.
Speaker 1 (35m 45s): I, but I, but I often joke that I talk to someone from the uk I say, speak English.
Speaker 2 (35m 53s): Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1 (35m 55s): Well, and, and I also, I also think personality, I mean, if you want my opinion, I think it's personality which goes along with banter.
Speaker 2 (36m 2s): Exactly. Right. Yeah. That is, yeah. You know, banter encapsulates quite a broad range of characteristics. You know, it's, it's not about necessarily being the most quick witted Yeah. Banter as in Yeah. I mean, like a good salesperson, you know, has to not be, and I think there are differences between American salespeople and British salespeople. Oh sure. The, the American model.
I prefer cuz they're like, right, let's get down to business. What's the bottom line? They wanna do business, you know, they wanna get things. Well,
Speaker 1 (36m 43s): You know what, I kind of, I kind of disagree with that because as someone, as someone who sold radio advertising for 21 years, and I've really always been in sales, you're in sales when you have your own company. I've always believed in establishing relationships with the people. And I think if you establish rapport banter, if you will, and relationships with the people that you are dealing with, then you know, it makes you better.
Okay. And it, it makes the people, just like you talk about with the models, it makes people realize that you care. And I do care, you know, I always have, and I've never looked at somebody as just a dollar sign. I look at them as someone that I can help in some way. And I try to help people in my current business, an adult site broker, even if we don't end up doing business, if I see something on their site that I think needs help, I'll make a comment or I'll suggest something.
And well, that also leads into our general consulting company if they need that much help. But at the same time, it's all about helping. And if you're helping then you're gonna do business.
Speaker 2 (38m 0s): Well ask me how many podcasts I've been,
Speaker 1 (38m 5s): I know you said this was your first one.
Speaker 2 (38m 7s): One, right? Yours.
Speaker 1 (38m 9s): Yes.
Speaker 2 (38m 10s): How many people do I know that sell or broker adult website sales?
Speaker 1 (38m 18s): I don't know. Probably me.
Speaker 2 (38m 21s): Just you? Yes. Why is, why is that? I'm not looking to sell my website
Speaker 1 (38m 26s): Yet.
Speaker 2 (38m 29s): This, oh my God. This is the long sell, isn't it? I've course,
Speaker 1 (38m 34s): Of course it is. Come on, man. Why do you think I, why do you think I do this podcast? This? It's, it's a promotional vehicle.
Speaker 2 (38m 42s): It's not, it's a scam. You're gonna just put I bet, I bet you're not even recording this. It's just going in the bin. You're just gonna try
Speaker 1 (38m 48s): And you're funny. Go ahead. It's
Speaker 2 (38m 52s): The, it's the long con, it's the long corner fallen
Speaker 1 (38m 55s): Through it, whatever, whatever you say.
Speaker 2 (38m 58s): Yeah. Remember you're on my, we'll do a, you'll be two weeks later, you're gonna call me up and you're gonna say, Hey, you know what? That you did fantastic on the podcast. We were number one on the Apple charts book. Yeah,
Speaker 1 (39m 12s): Right.
Speaker 2 (39m 13s): See it because you can't see it because it's, you know, adults. So, but I've got the figures and let's do a follow up. And then Yeah. And then the next thing you know, you're gonna come in, you're gonna come in hard once you've got my, you once you got my complete trust.
Speaker 1 (39m 33s): Yeah. I never cut. No, I'm sure I never come in hard except in, in the bedroom, so, oh dear. So, so Chris, what do you feel are the biggest challenges faced by the cam industry today?
Speaker 2 (39m 46s): Probably gonna be deep fakes, maybe. I mean, we're talking long-term here. Sure. You know, deep fakes, the sort of, you know, avatars. I mean, I don't think you can ever Mark Zuckerberg would lead us to believe that, you know, we can recreate human relationships by having these, you know, smiley, happy dancing. Well,
Speaker 1 (40m 13s): He's a bot. He's a bot. He's a bot. So he's a good example.
Speaker 2 (40m 17s): He's a robot. Yeah. He's a strange guy. It's weird that his avatar does look like him though. It's like they created the avatar before they created him.
Speaker 1 (40m 29s): They did. You know,
Speaker 2 (40m 31s): Technology will never replace the human to human contact without the interference of, I wouldn't say interference or enhancement of technology. So yeah. Potentially sort of deep fakes why talk to Jenner from Essex when you can design your perfect image of of a, of a woman.
Yeah. You know, or a man or whatever. And that's, that's something that I'd like to come onto actually before, yeah. Before we finish speaking. And there's one thing that I, I really want to get across to you, but I'll come to that. Okay. So you, you know, you've got deep fakes, you've got ai, you've got all of these technologies that, that are available. And I think they could potentially pose a threat to the webcam industry.
As I said, you know, if you can, if you can create, there's an eighties video, I can't remember the name of it, but where they, they did actually manage to create the perfect woman. Do you, do you remember the name of the film? No, no, it didn't. No. Yeah, it was this, the 1980s. It was the ahead of its time, but they created on their computer
Speaker 1 (42m 0s): Ahead of my time.
Speaker 2 (42m 4s): It was the ahead of its time. Ah. Because they, they were using a computer in the eighties to design an AI model. An AI model. Which was Yeah. Which was pretty remarkable foresight or, or Locke. You've got this photorealistic image and because it's an ai, it's gonna know that you got, you know, your promotion was on Thursday, it's gonna know when your birthday is.
You know, you are gonna get text messages saying, Hey, it's kandy, I'm sending you a boob shot or something like this. And this could all be done by computers. Yeah. Doesn't require any human interaction.
Speaker 1 (42m 51s): This is true.
Speaker 2 (42m 53s): So that would be my biggest fear. We star we, we looked at vr, we sort of touched, you mentioned that in the introduction. And we actually created a streaming platform for vr and it worked.
Speaker 1 (43m 14s): Yeah.
Speaker 2 (43m 15s): But despite what we believed, nobody was interested. They weren't interested. They would rather use their phone and have a FaceTime call than be able to get a 180 degree. And we spent time, you know, just getting the, the aspect ratio. Correct.
Speaker 1 (43m 37s): Who wasn't, who wasn't interested, the model or the user,
Speaker 2 (43m 41s): The users. They were, they just, they just didn't either. We didn't know how to reach them. And I'm sure they're out there. I'm sure there are lots of guys with vr, but VR didn't really take off as I thought it would. You know, I I mean when I first
Speaker 1 (43m 55s): Not yet. You're right, you're
Speaker 2 (43m 56s): Right.
Speaker 1 (43m 56s): Experience. It's been slow.
Speaker 2 (43m 58s): When I first experienced vr, I was just like, nobody's gonna buy a PlayStation again, you know, compute computer software. Right. Or, or other game development for pc. You may as you may as well fire everyone and get them trained up on 3D modeling and virtual reality and these sorts of tools because this is madness. You know, like, I'm in the game, this is great. Yeah. Right. And I still don't get it.
I still don't get why people, I mean, you know, you've also got Facebook behind it, which is one of the biggest companies in the world and they can't give the stuff away. Like nobody's Yeah.
Speaker 1 (44m 42s): I think it has a lot to do with the hardware and how clunky it is. And quite frankly, I don't like having to wear that headset to, to take in content. I've, I bought one and
Speaker 2 (44m 55s): Which one did you get? Oculus?
Speaker 1 (44m 57s): Yeah, the Oculus. I bought the Oculus. And I've, I've only used it a couple times. I, I just gotta tell you, it just doesn't feel natural. And I think a lot of people are the same way and they just haven't gotten enough hardware into people's hands to get critical mass. And I think that's the biggest problem with VR so far.
Speaker 2 (45m 20s): Sorry, when you say they haven't got enough hardware, are you talking about processing power or are you talking about
Speaker 1 (45m 28s): No, no, I'm talking about the, I'm talking about the headsets. There's just not enough in people's hands yet. And if you compare that to how many people who have have phones, it isn't even close. So to make something totally VR doesn't make sense because there's just not, to me, there's not enough of a market for it. Now some pay sites have done well with vr. Yes. Some are doing extremely well. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (45m 56s): Yeah. Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (45m 57s): I don't know if the same would, would carry over for Cams. It's really difficult to tell. And you, like you said, your experience hasn't been the best. So
Speaker 2 (46m 7s): The reason we didn't push it out as aggressively as we would've liked to is because the actual camera hardware, the webcams weren't up to scratch. You know, you've got, you've got problems when you are shooting VR video, right. So they're either ridiculously expensive, you know, $6,000.
Speaker 1 (46m 33s): Yeah. That's the other side of it. You've gotta get those in the hands of all the models and it becomes cost-prohibitive. Exactly. Because, because of the very tight profit margins.
Speaker 2 (46m 43s): Exactly.
Speaker 1 (46m 44s): For Cams. Exactly. So that, that makes it even harder than the pay site. So I think it's gonna be a long time before it's there and the hardware costs are gonna have to come way down on both ends. And it's just, I don't know, I don't see it anytime soon. So what did you say? The other challenge was
Speaker 2 (47m 2s): Also only fans as well?
Speaker 1 (47m 4s): Of course,
Speaker 2 (47m 5s): Of course only fans. I think, and this is another thing that I don't get, you know, I don't, I suppose, you know, we all base our opinions on our, our own sort of, you know, judgment calls. But just in the same way that, you know, if somebody told me three years ago that a company was gonna come along and they were basically going to charge customers to access videos of models and they were gonna pay a subscription for that, and a decent number of these girls were going to become millionaires within a day, I, I just wouldn't have believed it.
Yep. Particularly as, yeah, I was just amazed at the number of, yeah, I suppose the number of people that would be prepared to pay to Yeah. To see pictures, which, you know, they could, they could find similar pictures on the internet, but they pay a sort of subscription. And I'm just, to be honest, I'm just really jealous that it wasn't my idea.
Speaker 1 (48m 22s): Well, tell me about it. I I think there's many people that feel that way. The bottom, the bottom line on it is there's, there's absolutely no end to what a virtual girlfriend will bring about to a man. And that's what only fan, that's the power of only fans and all the similar sites. So Chris, I'd once again like to thank you for being our guest today on Adult Site Broker talk, and I hope we'll get a chance to do this again soon.
Speaker 2 (48m 50s): Yeah, it's been a pleasure talking to you, Bruce. A really interesting
Speaker 1 (48m 55s): Chat. Pleasure is all mine. My broker tip today is part seven of what to do to make your site more valuable for when you decide to sell it later. Last week we talked about trademarking your site and ways to make it unique. Next, when you decide to sell your website, make sure you have the following information available for potential buyers, detailed information about your company, your website, and any other aspects of your operation that the potential buyers may wanna find out about.
This should include for a pay site, a detailed inventory of your content, number of images, and number of videos, how much of it is exclusive, and how much is non-exclusive financial information for at least the last three years if your company is that old. This should include sales reports, profit and loss statements, and billing reports. Get all the information organized and legible format that a good broker can use to sell your property.
If you decide to sell it yourself, organize a list of potential buyers and start the process of contacting them. Be realistic about what your company is worth in today's market. The kiss of death is overpricing your property. Is there anything that a potential buyer needs to know, such as are you being sued? Do you have any substantial debts, et cetera. Don't let these things be a surprise to the potential buyer. They'll either find out before the sale and not buy, or they'll find out after the sale and you'll have another lawsuit on your hands.
Disclose everything. We'll talk about this subject more next week and next week we'll be speaking with Performer Christina Castilla. And that's it for this week's Adult Site Broker talk. I'd once again like to thank my guest Chris from Saucy Time. Talk to you again next week on Adult Site Broker Talk. I'm Bruce Friedman.